Earning a Doctorate in Her 70s

Chapter 1: From Humble Beginnings to Resilience 0:00 Two journals rejected me. I listened to my advisor, you know. I was glad to have an advisor say, move on, and you can do it. 0:08 Move on. And then my manuscript was published. I was number six and a premi of two pounds. Two pounds, wow. 0:14 I was born at home and there were no incubators in the hospital. 0:20 So two pounds, the doctor told my father, get a shoe box, line it with cotton wool and put Ann between you and her mother. 0:30 At night. That was me at two pounds trying my best to fight life. And I did it. 0:50 Welcome to the Degrees of Success podcast. I'm your host, Keith Chandler. Today's guest is someone whose journey redefines what it means to pursue purpose and impact at every age. 1:01 Dr. Ann Diese grew up on a banana farm in the Caribbean before earning scholarships that took her around the world and into nursing, midwifery, and ultimately, academia. 1:12 Through hurricanes, relocation, credentialing hurdles, and even a near-fatal car accident, Ann's determination has never wavered. 1:20 She spent decades advancing maternal and child health and clinical leadership and later devoted herself to teaching the next generation of nurses. 1:29 In her 70s, she decided to return to school and earned her PhD in nursing from University of Phoenix. 1:35 Despite every no she'd ever heard about that time, age, or circumstance. Today, we'll explore Ann's extraordinary path, how resilience, lifelong learning, and service shaped her success. 1:47 and how she continues to educate, inspire and lead with purpose. Let's dive in. Dr. Ann Diese, welcome to Degrees of Success podcast. 1:56 It's a pleasure. Thank you. You grew up on a banana farm in the Caribbean. 2:01 What early experiences and values from that time growing up shaped who you became today? 2:07 My father was born in Dominica. That's the way, you we had to go back there. 2:16 But he had business in Antigua, in the Caribbean, West Indies. 2:22 And so he started over there, and 15 of us were born there. 2:29 Not, he had 15, but about seven of us were born in Antigua before he went back to Banana. 2:37 So I'm number six. Out of 15 total kids, that's a huge, huge amount of, that's a big family. 2:46 Yeah, yes. So he had seven in Antigua and then had to go back to Dominica to continue. He had a lot of land in Dominica, banana industry had the same thing. 2:56 But I want you to know that I was number six in a premier of two pounds. Two pounds. Wow. 3:02 So it is interesting that I was born at home and there were no, you know, incubators in the hospital. 3:13 So two pounds. The doctor would come and visit my mother every day or every two days. 3:20 And the interesting thing of that, he told my mother, he told my father, the midwife, no, the doctor told my father, why don't you get a shoe box, line it with cotton wool and put Ann between you and your mother at night. 3:41 So. That was me at two pounds trying my best to fight life. 3:48 And I did it. So when I was five years, he closed the store and we all went back to Dominica. 3:59 He had 45 acres of land there. So his brother asked him, why don't you start the industry, the banana industry? 4:07 And we all went there, seven of us. And mommy had... Um, seven and 14 is 15 of us. 4:17 The rest of us were born in Dominica. Okay. The rest of the children. 4:21 So having been, you know, like me, which this age at 83 now I'm saying, I look back and I said, you know what? 4:32 I had to live. I had, I had to live and get all this experience. And that's what made me. 4:38 you know, get motivated to continue and continue and continue my education. 4:44 know, while I was there, about, went to school in Dominica and I went to the common school, the ordinary school, when I was about eight years of age. 4:58 You know, Papa had so many people and we were depending on the banana industry and that was nothing. 5:09 You know, so when I was eight years of age, the whole island was asking the students to do a scholarship. 5:21 They put out a scholarship for us to go to high school. And I participated in the scholarship. 5:29 It was a thousand students after that because the island is a poor island. And I came out second. 5:40 and got to go to the Convent High School free for my father. Wow, second out of 1,000 students that participated in the essay contest. 5:49 Yes, yes, it does. Do you remember what your essay was about by chance? 5:55 It was a lot of questions about what's happening in Dominica. It was a lot of questions. 6:04 And I must have given the answers correctly. So they told me, you pass and you will go to high school. 6:12 And in those days, it was high school run by the nuns. We had a lot of nuns in Dominica at that time. 6:18 So I went to high school and after the high school, I passed and went up to to the last form, they call it form. 6:25 And my sister, one of my sisters, elder sisters had gone to England and she asked me to come because she was working at the hospital um at the same, you know, at that time. 6:39 She asked me to come because I'm done, I'm finished. So I went and there at King's College Hospital I started there and passed, became a nurse. 6:51 We don't call them RNs, it's just nurse. Nurse Ann, nurse Diese, nurse Douglas. 6:58 My father is a Douglas. 7:01 So when I passed the King's College RN, nurse, then I wanted to do pediatrics because in my mind, I want to get back home to help them. 7:14 So I went on to pediatrics at the best hospital in London, the hospital for sick children. 7:20 um, in, at, um, in the, at Great Ormond Street in London. It was the best hospital. 7:27 So then after that, I went immediately straight to do midwifery because I want to be ready to go back home to help. 7:38 So I did midwifery in Kent and Canterbury hospital at, in Kent. And now I'm ready. 7:44 have nurse, RN, they didn't call it RN, but a nurse. pediatric nurse and a midwife, nurse midwife. 7:53 So when I was finished, my husband was, Michael was, was on finishes architectural studies as well, because he, he wanted, you know, go, just to go back home to help. 8:04 So the Dominica called us back and said, you know, can you please come back home to help? 8:11 Because we need somebody, you know, to help in housing and near the hospital. So we did that. 8:18 I had my child was three months already and we all went back home. And that's where he started. 8:26 My father started the banana industry because he has a lot of land and we continued there. 8:33 I, they gave me the, to be in charge of the, we had two hospitals on the island. 8:40 One was way back where, how was it? It took, it takes us about two and a half hours to get there. 8:48 from Roseau from main the city. So they put me in head of the children's unit. Chapter 2: A Lifelong Commitment to Education 8:56 And the children used to come in from different villages, way up in the mountains, they come in down there. 9:02 The doctor would call me, Ann, I am sending a child to you with diarrhea and vomiting. 9:09 Can you put an IV in? He showed me how to put the IVs in the head and the legs and all. 9:16 So can you put an IV of normal saline or whatever the saline fluid was and I'll be there. So he's traveling coming to meet me. 9:24 So anyway, he did that. 9:27 And at the same time, the concept of um primary health care came in from WHO, the World Health Organization. 9:38 They wanted islands like ours to put, the concept was. 9:44 to put clinics all over in far areas. 9:49 And that was manned a doctor, a nurse, a midwife, a dentist, pharmacist, and so forth. 9:57 even when I went back last month, last in November, we went back for my sister. 10:07 of 2025 this year. Yeah, this year, my sister passed. 10:15 went to the funeral. So the people who were driving us, my family who driving us around the island, there's a clinic, Ann, there's a clinic, one of the clinics. 10:27 So they have clinics all over the place. They followed. They followed the concept. So, yeah. 10:34 So let's go back. Let us go back here now. 10:37 um 10:40 I had just come to Dominica, being in head of the children's floor, where the government is asking, you, can you go to, we want you to go to the University of the West Indies in Jamaica to learn administration. 10:59 So I did a 13 month course in administration. 11:04 And when, after that, My brother was in, one of my brothers was in America already. 11:13 So he said, Ann, why don't you come and spend a week with me before you go back home? I did that. Once I was at his house, hurricane, very bad hurricane passed. 11:23 wow. Devastated the island. So I managed to, I waited and waited by his home and waited to see if can get a flight back. 11:31 Got a flight and went back. When I found out our house was gone. my goodness. All houses gone. 11:38 So uh I asked my husband, Michael was doing, helping in housing. 11:45 He was in charge of the housing just to build houses and things like that. And do architect he's an architect, so he was helping. 11:53 I asked him, can we take the children to St. Thomas, to your mother? Your mother lives there. Can we take them? 12:02 Because there's no schools, nothing. He said, all right. So I left him at home and I traveled in St. Thomas with the two children. 12:10 They got into school and I got a job in the labor and delivery unit at the St. Thomas Hospital in the maternity unit. 12:18 I got a job there, but I couldn't deliver because there was no reciprocity with England and Wales and American nurse midwife certificate. 12:29 So I could not deliver. I could only take care of the postpartum patients and things like that. Yeah. So why was I was there? So I had to stay in St. 12:37 Thomas Hospital and just take care of labor and delivery patients. 12:43 Why I was there, I noticed that there was a university of the Virgin Islands in St. 12:50 Thomas, US Virgin Islands. So I said, you know, why would I use that time? Why is that? I work nights. 12:57 I work nights on the maternity unit. Why don't I go to school during the day? 13:03 I went to school and did my bachelor's there. And then after I couldn't deliver a baby. So guess what? 13:11 The hospital administration sent me to Philadelphia, Maternity Hospital, which is no longer there. 13:18 Booth Maternity Hospital to do four months refresher course and take the American exam, midwives exam. 13:26 And I did that in past. now I'm a certified nurse midwife. 13:31 um I'm an RN and I did the pediatrics at the best hospital in London. 13:39 So now I'm covered. 13:43 Well, um after I did my bachelor's, got my bachelor's in Saint Thomas, US Virgin Islands, I say, why don't you apply to Georgetown University? 13:58 I was looking for university. I found Georgetown. and applied to Georgetown and they pulled me over. 14:06 I had to stay in the hospital itself, I had to stay around in the maternity, they gave me a room to stay there whilst I study and I passed. 14:17 I have my MSN now. 14:22 It's it's very much sounds like the word can't or no is really not in uh the vocabulary for you and you don't accept no for an answer or someone says no you're going to go that next step to do what you need to do to make that impact. 14:37 That is so true. Well, you know what, from the two pounds baby, I survived. So I'm that's what made me do this. 14:46 I think looking back at it. I survived two pounds. Yeah, and no, no incubators. 14:54 The doctor told my mom, my father took get some breast milk from my mother, put uh some drops of whiskey in the milk and give it to me. 15:03 oh How things have changed over the decades, right? 15:12 But I mean, there must be some sort of secret to it. It did work. I mean, it. This is a doctor telling my father to put her first of all, put her in. 15:21 You cannot put a baby between here. You go to jail for that. You cannot do that. Yeah. 15:30 And then, you know, having survived that with the whiskey in the milk, that's what to me, that's what's making me do what I'm doing. 15:39 And I reached 83 and I'm saying, I still want to do things. You know? Yeah. 15:46 You're still making that that impact and I mean that that early determination. 15:50 I mean just instinctually is within you to also give back and help other babies that that need health care uh in vital areas of the world, whether it's in the United States or or elsewhere. 16:04 Right, right, right. I went to live with my brother who is just up the road here and brought the two children with me. 16:13 Michael came up with the children and I got a job just up the road, like five minutes to work and stayed 20 years there as the director of maternal child health. 16:27 I had five units under me. 16:29 In those days, they didn't have the kind of baby friendly that you is rooming in and all that. 16:37 We had a nursery, we had a pediatric unit, had labor and delivery, and we had postpartum. 16:44 Remember the old days, that's what they call them up there. And I was able to join the postpartum with the baby, having rooming in. 16:55 I started that in the 20 years that I was up there. And m after... It was during that time, I loved to teach. 17:04 I was teaching students to pass the NCLEX exam, you know, but they would only give me maternity and pediatrics and you know, they will not. 17:15 Once I said, I'm a nurse midwife, you teach, you teach maternity then. That's what the administrators would tell me. Chapter 3: Empathy in Nursing and Mentorship 17:24 So I did a lot of that teaching and passing the NCLEX. 17:28 I, you know, Excuse me for saying that. I want to be humble. 17:34 I got so many uh accolades from the hospitals that I was there teaching the students. 17:45 Look at this. Yeah, what's what what are you pointing out behind you? 17:50 My, certificates Oh, beautiful. Oh yeah. Is that your University of Phoenix degree there on top? 17:58 It framed up? Nice. That one is Georgetown, all in Latin. 18:09 I had to call the university last week because I forgot, I wanted to write the date because I was doing something and I needed the date that I got the certificate. 18:23 I had to call the university and ask them, can you, this is in Latin and I can't remember how to read this. Can you tell me the date, please? 18:32 So she looked it up. She had to go look it up. Gave me some time to think, you know, to wait for it. And she got it. 18:39 She told me it's 1986. I think it really accomplished in oh no 1988. 18:46 I got the MSN. 18:52 So we are now in in Rancocas Hospital where I did 20 years there. 19:01 As matter of towards the end in the 20 years I started, 2012 I started to do the PhD. 19:07 And I just wanted, even though I got into an accident, there's COVID and hospitalization, when I got up, the advisors, not the advisors, the academic advisors, they were excellent. 19:26 They were really excellent. 19:27 When I was down, you know, like in the hospital, hospitalized, when I came back, they will say, you got to continue. You have to continue. 19:36 They were motivating me all the time. And I'm motivating myself too. I said, I don't want to stop here. 19:43 And then I continued like that with my PhD going through the years. And I got my PhD in 2020. 19:52 So your journey for the start of the PhD to the conclusion was about 11 years, is that correct? That's correct. 20:00 From 2012 to 2023. Yeah, perseverance if there is. Yeah. I said that's the preemie in me. 20:08 I think the premature child in me want to live and I'm helping people. 20:16 I'm helping the nurses. I got such love from them. I want to continue. 20:22 Such love from those nurses when they see they're doing so well and they're their NCLEX exams. 20:29 I remember just like in any times when I have, you know, been unfortunate enough to experience any sort of accident or anything like that. 20:38 It's always the nurse that leaves the lasting impression. There's the notion of, you know, people don't necessarily remember what you did, but how they made you feel. 20:47 And nurses have this level of empathy that really resonates with patients. 20:53 How important do you think is empathy to the job of nursing? the patients will get better quickly. 21:00 The patients, if they see that they have a lovely nurse, anything that you ask them to do, they'll do it for them to get better. 21:09 And you just keep close to them. You give them what they need and the care. It's just wonderful to be a nurse. 21:18 Really, really wonderful. So. Um, you, just have to continue, continue that way. 21:25 And then I have not stopped as yet for the education. I got my PhD in '23 and I was rejected from the, from my journals twice. 21:38 Twice. And that happens all the time. People get rejected all the time. Just go and look for another journal. 21:45 The first journal I looked for, got it. They accepted my manuscript. And I was gone. 21:54 I was just kept continuing and doing, moving. And the editors, I was lucky to get good editors. 22:05 They called me all the time. They write in back and forth. You did a very good job. You don't do this. And the editors, and I guess if you, it's your personality too. 22:15 I think so, you know, they interacted with me a lot. 22:19 And the next thing, One of the last editors said to me, you are, um we accepted your manuscript and you're going to be published in the next week. 22:36 And I was, my manuscript was published so fast, so fast, because they can reject you all the time. 22:46 And that takes time to get up again and start again, you know? So I was very lucky for them to publish it. Chapter 4: Inspiring Future Generations 22:55 Just a quick follow up to what you did have published. um How did it feel to actually kind of cross that finish line and get that publication in late 2025? 23:07 I was in heaven. 23:11 I said I couldn't believe that I got because people don't get published like that because they turn you down you remember I told you I got two journals two journals rejected me 23:23 One thing that I really respect and admire about the doctoral community is that level of support that I witness and see when it comes to any type of study, whether it's nursing, business, or anything across the spectrum. 23:37 Yes. Yes. So I listened to my advisor, you know, I was glad to have an advisor say, move on and you can do it. 23:47 Move on. 23:47 And then the first advisor who lives in Phoenix, he's been visiting me, not visiting me, but calling me once a week till last week and encouraging me to be calling me and saying, Ann, how are you doing? 24:04 How are you getting on? You're doing okay? And things like that. And I would tell him where I was at the time, you know, so I was really motivated by those Phoenix advisors were fantastic. 24:15 And the academic advisors and, and reviewer, fantastic, you know, so now I'm going to apply I have, I still have to apply to be a mentor. 24:28 So that's what that's the next thing I'm going to do. And I think that would be it. You're talking about mentorship. 24:35 You mentioned some great academic advisors. 24:38 I'm curious, are there any other mentors in your life, either personally or professionally, that you'd like to recognize and give credit to for kind of helping you maintain your resilience throughout your career, whether it's a family member or anyone else? 24:52 My husband. My husband, Michael. You know, he is so supportive. 24:58 He made breakfast for me this morning, always makes breakfast, lunch and dinner, whilst I am busy here? He is such a good person. 25:08 We've been married since, since, late sixties or early seventies. Thank you. 25:17 And it's a lot of time. You know, we, we've been together. 25:21 I spoke to other individuals that have gone through the doctoral process and I know that that can be stressful and it can be challenging on marriages and personal relationships of all types. 25:32 ah It sounds like you have a support system there that was definitely a rock for you. Yeah, definitely. 25:40 Sometimes he'd be sitting there, his computer is over there and I'm here. And he's so supportive. 25:47 Now he does all the shopping, the food shopping and things like that. He's retired, of course. 25:55 And he cooks a lot, gives me breakfast, lunch and dinner. He is fantastic. 26:03 He is my support. When I was wanting to give up, told me, give up, just keep going. 26:13 And he would support me with that. That's beautiful. And what do you hope people remember most about your journey? 26:19 I think when I talk about my journey, they are very amazed. And to see that I'm still at my age is doing more. 26:31 And it's the admiration that they have for me. They admire me. 26:38 And possibly I might motivate some of them to join something. I got that admiration. 26:46 Even my son is an engineer by the way. Congratulations. He lives in Maryland. Thank you. Civil engineer. 26:54 And also my daughter is a nurse. She's trying to follow mama. Exactly. uh Creating that next generation of nurses. 27:02 So, you know, I was thinking about the islands as well, Barbados. 27:07 Why don't I try to present this baby-friendly idea in Barbados, Jamaica, all over, see where they're at with baby-friendly? 27:18 Because even in Africa, my journals were in Africa. I tried to touch the world as well. 27:27 So... So that the people in Africa and Egypt, I mentioned that they were in their journals. 27:36 So I quickly grabbed it. I said, I'm sure the Africans or the Egyptians will read my study. 27:44 And if they don't have baby-friendly, you know, all the successful points that I am talking about in my study, they might do it too. 27:54 I can't wait to see what influence you have over the uh health care and the maternal community and the baby community in your mission to make hospitals and health care facilities baby friendly. 28:06 m I cannot wait to see what you do next and continue reading about your story and the work that you do. Dr. 28:13 Ann Diese, thank you so much for sharing your story and your wisdom and your perspective with us today. It is a great honor. 28:21 Thank you. Thank you for joining us on this episode of the Degrees of Success podcast. Dr. 28:27 Ann Diese's journey reminds us that success isn't bound by age, time, and or circumstance. It's shaped by resilience, curiosity, and lifelong commitment to growth and service. 28:37 Whether you're considering going back to school, pivoting in your career, or simply questioning what's possible in your next chapter, her story is proof that it's never too late to learn, lead, and make an impact. 28:48 If you enjoyed today's conversation, be sure to like, subscribe, share this episode and join us next time as we continue exploring the many paths that lead to success. 28:57 I'm your host Keith Chandler and this has been degrees of success where every journey counts.